Secret Weapons in Sovereign Grace

VIDEO TRANSCRIPT

Benjamin Kreps:

Hey everyone, and welcome to the podcast, where our aim is to connect our global family of Sovereign Grace churches with our Executive Director. Mark, in Sovereign Grace, when a man is called and ordained to pastoral ministry, we don't view the pastor's wife as the church gaining a second pastor — it's not a two-for-one deal. We are very much complementarian in our convictions, and the man is the one we see called. And of course what's going on in the home is important to the qualifications of an elder. Having said that, we see that the role of a pastor's wife is vitally important — as they serve and help their husband, as they care for the home, and as they have influence in the church in various ways as well. And so pastors and pastoral teams are wise to pay attention to how our wives are doing and to ensure that they are being strengthened and cared for. You want to talk to us about that.

Mark Prater:

Yeah, I do. Because as you said, I think pastor's wives are vital to a man's pastoral ministry. When I have an opportunity to encourage a pastor's wife publicly — which I try to seize on every opportunity I can — I say to them: you are the secret weapons in Sovereign Grace. And I choose that term deliberately. "Secret" means there is so much that they do that people don't see — that people in the church don't see, ladies. What a pastor's wife does in correcting her husband, talking with her husband, praying for her husband — that is so key to a man's pastoral ministry. And if you're doing those things as a pastor's wife, you actually strengthen his ministry, because God has chosen you for him and he needs you to do those things. So I just think: thank God for what you do.

But it's not just those things for your husbands — it's also what you do in your home that most people don't see. Just managing the home, caring for the kids, and so on and so on. I think pastor's wives work harder than their husbands do. They work very, very hard. And then on top of that, they're serving in the church as well — depending on gifting and season of life, they may be serving in different ways. And then add to all of that the need to navigate the family schedule in light of a husband's ministry responsibilities. That alone can be a challenge. So that's just a short list — I could give you a long list — but that's why I believe pastor's wives are so important to a man's pastoral ministry.

Benjamin Kreps:

Yes. It's hard for me to imagine being able to do the work that I do as a pastor without my dear wife Kate's consistent, daily help. So amen and amen to all of that. And I think any pastor listening to this or reading the transcript is hopefully saying amen and resonating with what you're saying. But we want to drop down another level into this to talk about how important all of this is — because the health of the pastor's wives in a church is vitally important not only to a pastor and his role in the church, but to pastoral teams and the health of a team as well. Talk to us about that.

Mark Prater:

Yeah. Just to echo what you just said — pastor's wives play an important role in pastoral team health, and we've just learned that from experience. Let me say: I think our wives do this so well, and they really do strengthen our pastoral teams. I think it's actually more challenging for them, because the pastors — the guys — get to spend more time together and therefore have more opportunity to cultivate team health. We've talked about team health on this podcast before, and even on the leadership team. We even have a team health evaluation tool that Jon Payne put together a few years ago, because we believe that healthy elderships produce healthy churches — and all of that leads to the glory of Christ.

But it's not just the guys who can strengthen or weaken pastoral team health — so can wives. They can strengthen it, or they can weaken it. And so I think it's best to just talk to the wives first. What do I mean by that? There are certain things I've learned and observed over the years that are not present in every wife — and I don't see this as a big issue in Sovereign Grace, but I want to address it. One example would be a wife who takes the perspective: "Well, he does his thing — he does pastoral ministry — I do my thing," with a bit of functional separation between a pastor and his wife. If your husband is called to ministry, you are called to help him in that. You've got to join him in his thing. That doesn't mean he doesn't support you in yours, but you are really called to that as a pastor's wife. So if you have any of those temptations, just be aware of them.

Another one I've seen is that pastors receive criticism — it's a part of being in church leadership — and pastor's wives can take up an offense against that criticism. It's really, really important that pastor's wives not do that, because it won't serve your husband and it won't serve the pastoral team. Maybe that criticism is coming from another elder on the pastoral team — and that's what you've got to navigate through, and it's really, really important. My wife Jill has done a remarkable job of not taking up offense against the criticism I've received, whether locally or extra-locally, even from our own pastoral team. She just holds my feet to the fire and calls me to faithfulness. And I'm grateful for her. So it's vital — vital for team health, both extra-locally and locally.

And then I think another one that is even harder in some ways is that a pastor's wife could potentially be struggling with another pastor on the pastoral team and not quite know what to do with all of that. And of course, I want to encourage you to talk to your husband — and husbands, you need to care for, shepherd, and lead your wives through that. But if you're having trouble resolving it, the pastoral team needs to be involved. And I think if you don't talk about those things in a transparent way, they will fester and undermine team health. So it's important to talk about them.

Which leads to this: I want to speak specifically to senior pastors who lead pastoral teams. You have a responsibility not only for team unity but for team health. And so you have a responsibility to make sure that pastors and wives on a team level spend time together — that's really important. As pastors and wives spend time together in a team context, you have a responsibility, senior pastor, to build a culture of transparency so that everyone feels free to share what's on their heart or what they might be struggling with. Cultivate that. And then you have a responsibility to make sure that when you become aware of a pastor and wife — or a wife — who might be struggling, you move toward them in a caring way: "Hey, I heard about this. Don't know if it's true or not. Can we just talk? I just want to help shepherd you through it." Those things are really, really important. And what that does is allow a pastor's wife to speak openly about any temptations or struggles she has. 

And that leads to the next group I want to address: all pastors who are married. Obviously, if your wife is struggling with something on the team, or a decision, or maybe another pastor on the team — take time to shepherd her through that, as I've already mentioned. But if you're having trouble resolving it, don't keep it just between the two of you. Go to at least the senior pastor or another team member and wife and talk through it — broadening the group depending on the size of your team — until you get transparency and clarity and can work through the issue. A lot of times these things are not addressed on a pastoral team because we're all busy, or because there's not a culture of transparency, or because you don't spend enough time together to trust one another. So cultivate that, senior pastors, and make a way for pastor's wives to be open and honest about anything they might be struggling with — that will cultivate team health.

Benjamin Kreps:

That's all wisdom and very helpful. And we're not in any way implying that all the pastors and wives on a team should all be best friends — of course for lots of guys, I'm sure, their best friends aren't on their team. But how happy it is when we do have very close friendships on a team. We do need to ensure that there is health, that there is friendship, that the relational connective tissue — the scaffolding — for the things you're describing is being put in place. And that leads to another question: what are some suggestions for best practices to foster this kind of unity, friendship, and health in a pastoral team?

Mark Prater:

Good question. And please add any thoughts, Ben, because I know you take this issue very seriously and you have your own practices at Living Hope there in Middletown, Pennsylvania.

First of all, consider a pastors-and-wives community group. I know many churches don't have pastors-and-wives community groups — and that's fine, I'm not saying change your practice. But if your pastors and wives are in a regular, member-led community group, you're going to get great fellowship there. But make sure that if you have that practice, you're also including a time for the pastors and wives on your team to be together in some sort of small group context — maybe just having dinner together once a month, or getting together to pray for one another once a month. Just making sure there's a regular rhythm of your team and their wives being together.

I think senior pastors need to take leadership there. One of the practices we've had at Covenant Fellowship — and I know other teams do this as well — is that once a year we have a pastors-and-wives retreat. There are a number of things going on during that retreat: updates, praying for one another, teaching, or reading through something together with discussion. But there are also long meals and a lot of laughter and wonderful times of ministry. That retreat has, over the course of time, really helped us as a team. So that could be a practice you adopt — I'm not saying you have to, obviously.

And then the third context to look to create is just intentional time for pastor's wives to be together. Ask one of the wives on the team to lead that time, give it some direction, but just make sure they get together on a regular basis. For example, at Covenant Fellowship, Jill is part of a fellowship group of about half the team — the wives of about half our team — and they get together once a month. They do fellowship together, they talk a lot, they pray together, they laugh a lot. Those are just some practices you might consider. So what would you add, Ben? What do you do differently?

Benjamin Kreps:

I don't know that I would do things differently — I can share briefly what we're doing over here. We have a monthly meeting with the pastors and wives, alternating in format. One month is an open family gathering — everybody can bring the kids, so it gets a bit wild — we have a cookout, share a meal together, and we're building that connective tissue between our families, including our kids. Because we want them to feel they're part of something God is doing at the church and on the team. Those would be more informal times, although a lot gets done there conversationally. Then every other month we're sitting together just as husbands and wives, talking about what matters most — how are things with parenting, how are things in your marriage. These are the qualifications of pastoral ministry, but also an opportunity to hear from one another. We spend time praying for each other and encouraging one another.

What I would add is: I think it's important, especially when something very challenging happens on a team, to make sure the wives are being included in that conversation. A couple of years ago we had a very significant issue on the team — a guy left the team, a very difficult experience. I had a meeting just with the guys — took them out to eat — and said: here's what we're doing tonight. Share everything you think about what just went down, including critiques of my leadership in that situation, things we could have done better. Let's not leave this meeting until we've all spoken our minds; I don't want anything lurking unnecessarily in the background. But then I did the exact same thing the next time we got together — this time with our wives — just to create space for: what was your experience? We want to make sure there isn't offense, or people carrying around bitterness, and we want to make sure everybody's heard. And so that includes me potentially hearing things I wouldn't prefer to hear, but that are necessary for me to know in order to grow and improve in my leadership. But we also want our wives to feel heard, understood, listened to, and cared for. 

I can remember a number of years ago — because we just have this regular practice — sitting in one of those meetings and a wife coming forward with a confession that she had been harboring some bitterness against someone else on the team for a while. There was confession of sin and forgiveness extended, and I think unity was strengthened through all of that. But some of those things just happen because of creating this regular rhythm of being together, getting to know one another, talking with one another — so that when the hard moments come, and they will come, we have the scaffolding, the relational connectivity, in place to be able to have that transparency and those honest conversations more easily. Because if you're scrambling in the middle of a crisis to establish this, it's going to be much more challenging. So don't delay. Basically, I'm just affirming everything you're saying and sharing some personal perspective there.

Mark Prater:

That's very good. And thanks for building a culture of transparency on your team — just taking steps like that. A couple of closing thoughts. This is to all pastors, but specifically senior pastors: don't sleep on this. Pastoral team health can get swallowed up by the urgencies of pastoral ministry, and you've got to be intentional about getting some sort of rhythm in your schedule for the men and for the wives on your team. So just don't sleep on this.

And then lastly, I just want to say again how I thank God for the pastor's wives in Sovereign Grace. They are remarkable women who strengthen their husbands' ministry and their church in remarkable ways — in a lot of ways that we will never fully see until that day when we get to see each wife rewarded with "Well done, good and faithful servant." So thank you, ladies, if you're listening to this podcast or reading it, for all that you do. And if a pastor is listening or reading and his wife isn't, please take time to encourage her regularly for all that she does. 

Benjamin Kreps:

That's beautiful, Mark — and amen to that. One more thought, because we want to make sure we're being careful and thorough with all of this: as you're evaluating men for pastoral ministry, I would suggest considering including their wives in these kinds of meetings. What we've done over the years — of course, that man needs to be able to meet the qualifications of an elder. But we're going to be very uncomfortable moving forward without understanding what their marriage is like, what she is like on a team, and relationally. So in so many different ways, it's important. Because we want to see — and thank God, in our churches we have so many capable ladies who make their husbands look so much better than we actually are. We want to protect that and ensure that remains our experience as we continue to move forward together in ministry and mission.

So Mark, thank you for your thoughts and your encouragement. And thank you to all the ladies out there who work so hard to serve and to care for their husbands and their homes and to serve in the church. There is a long list we could spend time going over, but thank you to the ladies who are checking out the podcast — the faithful wives. And thank you, everybody else, for checking out the podcast as well. We'll see you here next week, Lord willing. Bye for now.